Naruto MUSH Legacy



  • Greetings!

    Just wanted to leave a notice to let people know that we've opened a new game: Naruto MUSH Legacy. This is a project that we started developing on and off in 2014. It's gone through a few iterations, the last of which began development in October 2016. Through all we've learned in this process, we've finally gotten to a point where we can invite the public in to play. Our hope is that with player input and suggestions, along with a dedicated development team that this game will be around for a long time.

    Details about Naruto MUSH Legacy can be found on our website: https://narutomushlegacy.com/ There you can find a FAQ and a web version of our +help files (still a work in progress). We allow guest connections, but we always like to encourage people to make a character and hop into CG. Our Character Generation process is designed to help people understand the basics of the game or at least point out what they need to know right of the bat. We also allow new characters to go back to CG after approval to change up things until they reach 10,000 XP. It helps to know a bit about Naruto, but with so many resources about the series on the web, a complete knowledge isn't a requirement.

    What we offer is a player-driven, paragraph-style RP environment. Over time, and especially with the addition of our Faction system which is currently in development, we're hoping to empower players to lead the direction of the Major and Minor countries in the world of the Naruto series. For now, the focus is primarily on the Land of Fire and the Land of Noodles. We already have a few other Minor countries and the Land of Water in mind though.

    Experience points on NML are gained purely through roleplaying. The system is dynamic and applies modifiers to the room and to the players that affect how much XP is gained, accounting for pose size, how many people are present, if any characters are new, if a plot is happening, and what kinds of relationships exist between players. Each night, accumulated XP is distributed to each player based on the effort they put in.

    Mechanical growth happens by investing gained XP into stats, specialties, jutsu (ninja techniques), and RP skills. However, we leave RP mostly up to the players and encourage Freeform interaction so that people can really explore whatever story they desire in their time on our game. We try to be pretty open to most things so long as players are respectful to our requirements and our theme.

    The community that supported us in our beta period was the best! Today alone, our first day of launch we've had a max of 38 player connections with about 20 unique connections. The public channels have been hopping and keeping us busy with a ton of questions. Many even have been hopping into RP just as soon as they get approved. The show of support has just been fantastic and really makes us feel like all that development time is worth it!

    So, here's an open invitation for any interested to give NML a try. We don't claim to be the perfect game for everyone, but we have a lot to offer to those who want to make stories with us. ^_^



  • Ok, but like. Let's ask the real questions. Is this the game that's suspected to be Elsa/Zero/Onyx's?


  • Admin

    Just let it go, @Meg.



  • @Meg said in Naruto MUSH Legacy:

    Ok, but like. Let's ask the real questions. Is this the game that's suspected to be Elsa/Zero/Onyx's?

    Who? O_o



  • @Benzaiten said in Naruto MUSH Legacy:

    @Meg said in Naruto MUSH Legacy:

    Ok, but like. Let's ask the real questions. Is this the game that's suspected to be Elsa/Zero/Onyx's?

    Who? O_o

    Aside from that, on a more serious note.

    Do the people who were present before the July 22nd open date listed on the wiki have a bunch of XP/etc above and beyond what new players will have?



  • @Tempest People who participated in our beta period were allowed to keep any XP they earned via RP. I also elected to give all beta testers 100 LP because LP gain wasn't possible through most of beta. Neither of those things are unobtainable by new players, but it, of course, will have to be earned through normal means now that the game is live.


  • Pitcrew

    @Benzaiten said in Naruto MUSH Legacy:

    @Tempest People who participated in our beta period were allowed to keep any XP they earned via RP. I also elected to give all beta testers 100 LP because LP gain wasn't possible through most of beta. Neither of those things are unobtainable by new players, but it, of course, will have to be earned through normal means now that the game is live.

    How many months ahead does that put beta testers in terms of advancement? Mathematically what kind of difference are we looking at here if a new player fights a beta tester?


  • Coder

    @Meg said in Naruto MUSH Legacy:

    Ok, but like. Let's ask the real questions. Is this the game that's suspected to be Elsa/Zero/Onyx's?

    The mush is zero-free, @Meg :)



  • @Salty-Secrets said in Naruto MUSH Legacy:

    @Benzaiten said in Naruto MUSH Legacy:

    @Tempest People who participated in our beta period were allowed to keep any XP they earned via RP. I also elected to give all beta testers 100 LP because LP gain wasn't possible through most of beta. Neither of those things are unobtainable by new players, but it, of course, will have to be earned through normal means now that the game is live.

    How many months ahead does that put beta testers in terms of advancement? Mathematically what kind of difference are we looking at here if a new player fights a beta tester?

    This is kind of a difficult question to answer directly because there's a lot more to our game than pvp. I would argue pvp is a really minor factor at the moment, honestly.

    So the best I can do is say that a Beta character who actually uses the 100 LP will be at about what one might consider a Chuunin in the series, whereas a new player can come in anywhere from student to senior genin strength straight out of CG.

    But here's a tip for anyone who wants to come in as a new player: Focus on RP skills. Because the beta players sure haven't. And RP skill levels are THE key to successfully completing missions! Which is how you earn LP. :)

    I know that answer isn't mathematical in nature but I hope it helps. Our system is really far too complex for me to just post numbers with no real context of what's going on. I fear such numbers would mean next to nothing because "What does a well-built character roll?" is a highly interpretive concept that depends on a LOT of considerations.



  • What is going to encourage a person to join when 'beta testers' are already ahead (RP stuff or not)?



  • @icanbeyourmuse

    Not that guy, but playing devil's advocate.

    What encourages people to join already-established WoD MU*s where dinosaurs sometimes have hundreds more XP than a new character? Enjoyment of the theme.



  • @Bobotron Although, at the same time sometimes it causes those people to flee when faced with those dinosaurs. Often on WoD I opt to go young because then I have the excuse of being a young person to why I can't keep up with people with insane amounts of XP



  • @icanbeyourmuse
    Right. The only reason I replied to that is because, that's kindof a meh question. Also, it's very similar in the setting. A Genin is just out of the ninja academy IIRC, so neonate vampire-esque. It's not that much different.


  • Admin

    @Bobotron said in Naruto MUSH Legacy:

    What encourages people to join already-established WoD MU*s where dinosaurs sometimes have hundreds more XP than a new character?

    Most MU* these days have catch-up mechanisms of some sort (or they should) or at least massive diminishing returns. It's been a while at least since I saw a true discrepancy between oldbies and newbies in terms of truly unbridgeable gaps between the two groups.

    Enjoyment of the theme.

    That's a common argument but I don't like it. You can enjoy the theme with more XP as well as with fewer.



  • I have a few minutes so I will attempt to give you all some more mathematical representations of the difference. Was at work yesterday and in no place to respond properly.

    We had about 40 individual players participate in beta from January to July. Not all of them were active, but that's how many accounts were made.

    Of that pool, 24 have made accounts for launch. This is not including new players.

    Of those 24, one person earned over 15,000 XP. Three earned between 10,000 and 12,000 XP. Nine earned between 1 and 5,000 XP. The rest earned 0.

    The activity as far as code testing varied. Many of the people who earned nothing only code tested while some of the high XP earners did nothing but RP (which is kind of a form of code testing for the XP system...)

    We chose to give all of these 24 players 100 Legacy Points (LP) as a small, modest "Thank you!" There are some people I would have given a lot more, but I didn't want to make things too unbalanced for launch.

    We are currently estimating that a player of average activity should be able to earn about 10,000 XP and 15 LP per month, possibly a lot more if someone plays more than one character. XP is gained by a metric we use to judge RP effort whereas as 1 LP can be gained every week passively and the rest come from using our Mission system. This will adjust as we continue to monitor activity on the game, but it's the standard we're aiming for with payouts.

    When we balanced out how much XP it should take for someone to create what we would consider a "good," jounin-level character build, the number came out to over 250,000 XP. This includes stats, jutsu, jutsu proficiency, specialties, expertise, transformations, trancendences, and RP skills - all of which go into creating a well-rounded character and all which affect characters in hundreds of ways.

    I can give you a baseline example of roll ranges based on the increasing of a single stat, but I need to warn you that this example is very basic and a highly unrealistic reflection of what can be achieved in the game. It will not account for resources, which vary by a great degree from player to player depending on their build, and jutsu proficiency, which can tighten roll ranges, reduce Ability Point cost, reduce resource cost, increase damage, etc. It might, however, demonstrate that we've tried to create some overlap between stat tiers.

    So, with all that said, here is a list of E-rank Taijutsu hit rolls with nothing special and no jutsu improvements, only increasing the Taijutsu stat from 2-10:

    2: 28-57
    3: 30-60
    4: 32-62
    5: 34-65
    6: 36-68
    7: 38-71
    8: 40-73
    9: 42-76
    10: 44-78

    Taijutsu-focused students straight out of CG would likely have 3 in Taijutsu. Whereas a Taijutsu-focused chuunin might have at least a 6. So the overlap there is 36-60. A pretty wide range with nothing else accounted for.

    So, with the most only one player earned being 15,000 XP and the rest earning less than that, I can't say that I can agree that the argument of beta players being really far ahead is a valid one. They're barely ahead, maybe. Even if someone converts all the LP they get into XP (which would be 50,000 XP), it's a drop in the bucket when you look at the progression of multiple characters. (Most people have 2-3 characters.) I can understand the concern though which is something I considered before making these decisions to give our beta players a small amount of gratitude for all the work they did to help us.

    Should a person come to the game two years from now, is it right for me to make what our veteran players have earned by that point mean less to them just so everyone can feel equal? To be honest, while that does concern me, it's not a modality that is attractive to me. We try to encourage player death the best we can so there is a bit of movement in the power players vs. the newbies, but I will never just say "You've been RPing your butt off for 2 years to get to this point, but I'm going to make it mean less or take it away just because new players can't compete."

    So, if that's the kind of mentality that bothers you, NML will not be right for you and I have no qualms about stating that outright. I'm of the mind that it's best to try and be clear about how things work from the get-go so that players don't waste their time with assumptions of how things will work. That is not to say that we are not willing to adapt and change. If our active players say they'd rather have a system with diminishing returns, we would definitely take that into consideration and decide what we can do to adapt the game to player wishes. But, for now, that's not the way the game operates as a whole.

    And, as a side note, I really hate that I will never be able to catch up my item level progression to that of hardcore FFXIV players, but I still love that game and would be mad if they took away my unrealistic goal of being maxed out. @_@



  • @Arkandel
    Re: Enjoyment of the theme

    Well, yea, but the implication of te original post read, to me, like 'Well, all these people have X more XP, why should we bother?'


  • Admin

    @Bobotron The reason I don't think what happened in this thread is significant is just that the MU*'s staff are very upfront about it, which is all I can ask. After all XP and power disrepancies is nothing new - plenty of games have feature characters, tiered roster ranks, etc... which then makes it their perspective players' choice whether that's a deal breaker or not. The facts are on the table, take it or leave it.

    All I was saying is that I don't think the fact some players (commonly oldbies) have inherently and disproportionately more power than the rest isn't a factor to consider. It is, and not just for PvP environments. Plus it's one thing to play somewhere an active oldbie just happens to have had <X> more months to pile up XP than you did, which is a very common and reasonable scenario, and a different for any oldbie to have more XP/magical items/etc regardless of how active or good they were during that time, just because they were present during alpha or whatever.


  • Pitcrew

    @Arkandel I think you are totally right. My issue here is that one of the cool things about joining a game in its inception is that everyone is establishing themselves, everyone is new and getting to know the setting, the system, etc. The vibe I get when something like this happens is that not only these people helped shaping the game in the beta, but they learned the systems in a no consent game and get a headstart... when the game is 0 days old. It just puts me off a bit.


  • Admin

    @SunnyJ What grinds my gear is if they have access to stuff newer players, for all intents and purposes, can't get any more. This can take on different forms.

    The most common one by far is ranks; there's often a mad rush when a game opens, no joke, where there's this informal dancing chairs mini-game being played as players frantically apply for the cool positions, even ones they barely intend to play. So you end up with thematically important Houses, Changeling factions, Praxis ranks etc all taken up and hogged right away by rights of first-come first-served.

    But there are others. Time-gated skills or items handed out like candy during alpha which now take RL months for newer people to get, custom Legacies controlled by whoever pitched them first whose attainments can't be duplicated by new ones.

    Hell, even roster characters - I understand on at least one comics game there were complaints because one person was playing practically the entire Justice League roster and he was an iffy roleplayer to boot.

    All I'm saying is game runners need to be aware of the issues these things cause since they're factors in more than PvP.



  • @SunnyJ I can understand the concern about this being a no consent game, but it isn't. No one can kill another character unless the target chooses to engage in a scene with the killer. RP on NML is purely consent based. The only time we override this rule is if the target has actually done something to warrant being hunted in this fashion. At that point, staff gets involved to make the hunting process as fair and unbiased as possible for all parties involved. And even then, scenes aren't required if two players do not wish to RP with one another. In a case like that, we will use the coded systems we have in place to help create an outcome for both players to carry on into their RP. This is partially in response to some of us having played on a full-consent game where the rule was used as a shield to escape IC consequences. We've tried to do the best we can to make things fair without forcing people to have to interact with one another.

    @Arkandel I do think the biggest advantage beta players have is knowledge. But even worse than that is the knowledge of Staff, who are also allowed to play on the game without restriction. We chose to make our alts public though so that if that's a real issue for people, they can just choose to not RP with us. While we will not force players to have some 'beta' tag on them, there is nothing that prevents a new player from asking straight up, "Are you a beta player? Because if you are, I don't want to RP with you." But to be honest, that's not the kind of dynamic we're trying to promote on the game. I do think you're focusing a bit too much on the competitive, pvp side of things, which is your choice of course, but I just don't see it as being as much of a factor. Even two players opposed to one another are creating a story together, and a good player will realize when they might have an advantage and do what they can to offer the same advantage their opponents.

    As far as limited access to ranks, I don't understand this assumption. I would say that the only limited ranks we have right now are Clan Heads, which wouldn't be something anyone could earn through a coded means in any case. The Clan Head position has been worked out with people that we think will drive RP and just having the position doesn't grant them anything other than the expectation that they're going to drive RP. Kage could be considered a limited rank, but that position isn't even on the table at the moment. The rest are worked out in RP to be honest. There are Jinchuuriki (hosts to powerful creatures) of which we can only ever have 9, but that also isn't on the table for anyone at the moment. There are limited clan slots - 10 per clan - which is accessible on a first-come, first-serve basis, so maybe that? We've tried to balance clans though and none of them are actually filled up at the moment, not even the Uchiha, which is surprising to me. Other than that, we have no abilities that are single-person or anything like that.


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